Transcript-Dayne's Chat of 8/29/07
08/29/07 – Chat
Dutch:: Hey how are you ... gotta ? about the CPSs -- particularly 1977. Are
the manager preference sliders supposed to bee all "Neutral"?
DMBDayne:: LOL. Sorry, I can't answer tech questions... you'll need to ask Luke or Diesel.
JT Dutch:: Ahh OK no prob
nemodomi:: I just want to say that I respect you for your apparent openness to converse, Dayne.
#timz:: Not the best of times on the forum these days
nemodomi:: Not always easy being #1, huh?! ;-)
DMBDayne:: No, it has not been good. We have had a hard time understanding the animosity, frankly.
#timz:: It puzzles me, too...not that there is some, but its extent
nemodomi:: In case you've read any recent comments by me, I want to admit that the recent 2DBB events plugged me into some of my own personal "stuff" and I've reacted. But I think it's a shame when it seems that things can't be worked out amicably for all concerned.
DMBDayne:: 2DBB was asked to tone it down, and then he was warned. Several times.
DMBDayne:: We have tried being communicative - that did not work.
DMBDayne:: We tried ignoring it. That did not work.
nemodomi:: I certainly have no awareness of everything that's gone down between you and 2DBB, but ... just my opinion ... you could swat a home run by engaging Stephen privately and working things out.
#timz:: I'm under the impression that was tried more than once, though, nemodomi
nemodomi:: oh ... few seem aware of the warnings ... a missing piece on the boards
LynchMob1966:: I think it is understood
LynchMob1966:: that he was warned
#timz:: I think they tried to handle it with more private communications instead of calling 2DBB out publicly
DMBDayne:: I also do not think it is appropriate for one customer to demand and expect personal communication. The company will fail if we do that all the time.
#timz:: which seems to me the appropriate way to approach it
rldp4444:: Hey Dayne, by banning 2DBB, is he still allowed to purchase from your company?
DMBDayne:: not to mention the fact that the individual involved engaged in nasty personal attacks of me. I have no desire to engage with someone behaving like that.
gamer58:: Thanks for having the chat Dayne
nemodomi:: Dayne since Stephen posted Luke's email on his personal e, site, I suggest you'd do well to non-defensively let people know your side of the story. Silence on your part, in this situation, seems only to worsen the public image thing. You don't OWE anyone any explanation, of course.
DMBDayne:: We may do that.
DMBDayne:: good suggestion
DMBDayne:: Let's just say that I felt a line had been crossed this past weekend. We tried to be tolerant, but we felt that we owed it to the community to do something.
rldp4444:: What line was that?
DMBDayne:: Given that I expect the text of this message to end up posted somewhere, I will refrain from specifics. I hope you understand.
rldp4444:: The IS forum has a lot of material many here would feel is inappropriate, why the double standard?
DMBDayne:: Or, rather, I must assume that.
DMBDayne:: The IS forum is different.
rldp4444:: Please explain.
DMBDayne:: It has specific warnings that there may be offensive postings and that we do not monitor that OT board.
DMBDayne:: We also have a means on the IS board to mark posts as "NOT SAFE"
rldp4444:: Then why not do so on this board?
DMBDayne:: We may do that.
#timz:: In all honesty I hope the DMB board doesn't go that way even if such a mechanism exists
DMBDayne:: We don't own this board, so we are limited in what we can do.
#timz:: What useful purpose would it serve...you can already post whatever you want on the IS board
rldp4444:: Have you read some of the stuff on the Off Topic board from Toldya?
DMBDayne:: political stuff?
DMBDayne:: I did read some of it, not all.
dewelar:: Sorry I wasn't here earlier, I was talking to Pat.
PutOnYourCheTshirtHolmeed:: why does Imagine/Simnasium/DMB Online not plunk down a few $$ to get the DMB forum more in line with the capabilites of the IS/DMBO forum?
#timz:: Maybe the Off Topic forum here should be eliminated and anybody desiring to post Off Topic should be directed to the IS board?
DMBDayne:: We are exploring our options. We cannot do everything at once. We are not a big company.
rldp4444:: Ok. So the virulent anti-Semitic comments and cartoons were deemed by you to be correct but a few mildly erotic pictures of women crossed the line of decency?
DMBDayne:: I did not see any such posts.
DMBDayne:: And, rldp, if this is going to turn into an inquisition, this chat will end.
PutOnYourCheTshirtHolmeed:: I believe that Dayne probably agrees with the views of toldya. He is, after all, a Howard Dean supporter
dewelar:: *rolls eyes*
#timz:: Personal attacks aren't going to do anyone any good...
PutOnYourCheTshirtHolmeed:: you believe Dayne is content-neutral?
#Spaceman:: It is his product and site
rldp4444:: I'm just asking questions. I'm not conducting an inquisition.
DMBDayne:: there we go
dewelar:: Well, when someone's username is a personal attack, should we expect them to be rational?
gamer58:: this is suppose to be about dmb I thought, 2DBB was upset about the lack of old seasons coming forward I think that is where this started, llet's start with that
PutOnYourCheTshirtHolmeed:: give me a break, dewelar. that's a rhetorical dodge.
nemodomi:: GEEZE GUYS howzabout some courteous genuine conversation here instead of venting and attacking? Cripes.
DMBDayne:: My political beliefs are not relevant to this discuss.
dewelar:: Yes and no, POYCTH.
rldp4444:: Ok Dayne, what do you want to talk about?
#Spaceman:: I'd MUCH rather hear from Dayne about the future of DMB
#Spaceman:: ... or what he listens to when playing ...
SmokinBats:: same here
gamer58:: let's get this in line no talking about politics, religion & somebodies else's mother <g>
SmokinBats:: thank you gamer
dewelar:: POYCTH: If you had something with substance to say, I'd respond with substance.
DMBDayne:: We're 10 minutes into this chat, and nobody has yet to ask about the game.
#timz:: hi luke...fun week?
#Spaceman:: I did
rldp4444:: Talk Dayne about the game
DMBDayne:: I listen to NPR while playing DMB.
#Spaceman:: What is the story on V10
gamer58:: I just did Dayne what about the old seasons say 1964 ?
#Spaceman:: NPR - I like it
dewelar:: I'd like to know if Version 10 is on the board at this point.
DMBDayne:: We have had some discussions about v.10. To be honest, we think the game needs a code overhaul.
dewelar:: I'd also like to know if there is any plan to make the game accessible to the visually impaired.
DMBDayne:: wow, that's an interesting question, dewelar.
DMBDayne:: I had never thought about it, frankly.
#Spaceman:: What would be gained by a code overhaul?
DMBDayne:: better UI, for one thing
#Spaceman:: Sincer question
dewelar:: My wife is legally blind, and my own vision is poor. I have been asking for customizablitiy of this nature for some time.
dewelar:: User interface.
dewelar:: A better UI would be a good first step :) .
DMBDayne:: I think some of the things we're considering would help, yes.
kickthedonkey:: What language9s) is DMB written in? Rewrites are often necessary to allow new functionality (I'm speaking from experience)
rldp4444:: What about improved graphics?
DMBDayne:: One reason we limit what we're saying is that we're considering some things are, well, out there.
#Spaceman:: What about the engine, and some of the enhancements suggested by many of us over the last few years?
DMBDayne:: I don't want to tip off the competition.
#timz:: Dr. Arbiter had some interesting comments on improving the UI that may still be floating around on the board somewhere (spos?)
PutOnYourCheTshirtHolmeed:: Don't you think it's more despicable to use the forum to post anti-Semitic comments and to do political grandstanding in threads about dead college students than it is to criticize the CEO or to cuss?
SmokinBats:: isn't there a way to ban someone from the chat?
kickthedonkey:: Can we please discuss the game itself?
#Spaceman:: By "out there" I really hope you DON'T mean eliminating the stand alone game ...
#timz:: I don't see any of those things as positive, honestly
dmbluke:: Don't know
RedTurkey:: what about improvements in the computer manager. The old seasons don't do so well with the current one
SmokinBats:: then do us all a big favor and leave!
DMBDayne:: PutOn... who are you?
dewelar:: Elan, I want to publically apologize to you.
gamer58:: I think it's 2DBB
dewelar:: Regarding what I said on the General Board.
#Spaceman:: Dayne, I HOPE you realize MOST of us AREN'T @$$holes
sposfan1:: john, we're cool. really.
sposfan1:: but thank you, it is appreciated
DMBDayne:: We do realize that, yes.
gamer58:: Dayne what do you see as far as released products for the next 12 mths
#Spaceman:: Good to hear :^)
rldp4444:: What about improved graphics?
DMBDayne:: We have something coming very soon.
DMBDayne:: We have a new disk to release.
dewelar:: I didn't get the impression we were cool from your e-mail :) .
gamer58:: what year
#Spaceman:: wait for it ... wait for it ...
DMBDayne:: It's an oddball sort of thing. Luke and Jim have already done the work.
DMBDayne:: I'd rather not say at the moment, unless Luke thinks he's ready to spill the beans.
nemodomi:: nice teaser!
rldp4444:: What is coming very soon? Graphics or new product?
#timz:: "The collected posts of sposfan1...the unabridged edition?"
dmbluke:: hey, I want to see 2207!
smackie1970:: you're on the Mariners i think
gamer58:: come on Luke give!
#Spaceman:: Yeah, Luke!
SmokinBats:: I just want to know when we're going to see a patch to fix MLB- I mean a team scoring 30 runs in a game is just ridiculous.....
gamer58:: hey I'm an O's fan
rldp4444:: Ok, one more time. What about improved graphics?
SmokinBats:: I am too gamer..... I was driving home from vacation listening to that on the radio.
dmbluke:: If any of you have see the latest Baseball Prospectus book just out, there's a section about using DMB to play 12 of the worst teams
dewelar:: 1899 Spiders coming!
dmbluke:: We'll be releasing it. Three brand new teams for DMBers and yes, the '99 Spiders
#timz:: All-Time Worst Players disk -- Oscar Zamora's got to make the cut
#Spaceman:: Dave Rosello
DMBDayne:: Also, we plan to do all seasons going back to 1901.
dmbluke:: They picked a worst team by decade starting with the 1890's
#timz:: If you go by single seasons the 1969 Billy Grabarkewitz is a shoo-in
dewelar:: Bill Bergen
SmokinBats:: I think it's Worst Teams disk- meaning no individual players but rather like the '62 Mets, '03 Tigers for instance
dewelar:: Seriously, though, any release of new teams is good news.
dmbluke:: Worst teams
#timz:: Cubs 2006?
dewelar:: Who's the choice from the '70s? '77 Jays?
#Spaceman:: I have to leave, but I hope there will be a transcript of this sans the idiotic ranting
#Spaceman:: bye guys
rldp4444:: What about Negro leaguers?
SmokinBats:: are the '88 O's on that I'm thinking?
gamer58:: gotta go too, thanks to Dayne for the opportunity
CUBS06:: Hi guys
SmokinBats:: Marlins '98 I'd think as well.......
dmbluke:: Hold on and I'll dig up the list
SmokinBats:: that is a nice fun idea though....
dewelar:: As for the seasons going back to 1901, is there any kind of timeframe?
DMBDayne:: as soon as Jim and the team can get 'em done.
SmokinBats:: yeah- that's awesome news about the seasons going back to 1901.....
kickthedonkey:: Dayne, is DMB used by other on-line simulation game (other than DMB online obviously)?
DMBDayne:: next year, I think
SmokinBats:: my gosh that's awesome!
kickthedonkey:: ANY other ... can't type
rldp4444:: What about Negro leaguers like those listed on the IS site?
DMBDayne:: or am I freaking you out, Jim?
CUBS06:: Great news on 1901-27. Can the game engine handle old seasons?
DMBDayne:: let me answer the question about graphics.
psieczko:: With the code overhaul would all the features of the DMB Trilogy like Home/Road splits, RISP, etc be integrated into the game?
SmokinBats:: that'd be awesome!
DMBDayne:: too early to get into those kinds of specifics
DMBDayne:: The issue with graphics is this...
dmbluke:: I'm confident we'll be adding lots of new splits
CUBS06:: Or I should say, can the game engine accurately reflect the statistics from those old seasons?
DMBDayne:: The current code limits what we can do. So, it makes more sense to explore options to rewrite part or all of the code so we can "do it right".
SmokinBats:: would we be concievably looking at something kind of like watching a game on ESPN Gamecast or something like that?
DMBDayne:: no comment
DMBDayne:: one thing you all should realize...
dewelar:: I hope not. The screen is already cluttered enough.
DMBDayne:: changing graphics should be an enhancement, not a distraction
SmokinBats: or like Sportsline's game site- where if you put your cursor on a players box line for the game, a small popup comes up with that guys season stats to date... that'd be really nice to have with dmb I think.....
SmokinBats: where it doesn't distract- but it adds to things I think......
dewelar: That's not a bad idea, as it's triggered by an event as opposed to being part of the display.
DMBDayne:: yes, we've looked at that, actually
rldp4444:: What about a career option?
SmokinBats:: that would be so awesome
dewelar:: As long as you avoid anything done by FOX Sports :) .
SmokinBats:: yeah- no glowing baseballs or anything like that
DMBDayne:: we've explored a career option as well
dewelar:: I do NOT need Scooter on my screen.
DMBDayne:: no glowing baseballs, tho
DMBDayne:: Joe Morgan will do the PBP, however.
#timz:: I was going to suggest Tim McCarver
DMBDayne:: (just kidding!)
kickthedonkey:: Steve Lyons
dmbluke:: And sausage races for the Brewers' games!
dewelar:: If he's in there instead of the Ken Harrelson calls that are in there now, it's acceptable.
#timz:: Including a "create your own sausage" capability
rcm3739:: Greetings from Oaktown.
dewelar:: Any plans to improve the drafting function?
SmokinBats:: one thing I'd like to see added to the game screen would be a scoring summary option like you see on so many sites now
rldp4444:: How about out-of town scores?
DMBDayne:: No, we haven't thought about the drafting function, but I'd agree it needs to be fixed.
dewelar:: Out-of-town scores as a button somewhere would be good.
DMBDayne:: or, rather, improved.
rcm3739:: I'd go with "fixed."
dewelar:: Yeah, I'm tired of having to fix teams with only one catcher.
DMBDayne:: I only have a few more minutes. Any more questions/commetns?
dmbluke:: The hardest part about drafting is that there are so many different kinds of leagues with different rules
rldp4444:: Please make nice with 2DBB.
dmbluke:: For example, single-season versus continuous
dewelar:: I would think it should assume single-season, no?
rcm3739:: Obviously the AI programming is intensive. But maybe just a toggle for Career vs Single Season, would go a long way. Add some roster balancing logic, or toggles.
#timz:: The auto-draft should just focus on drafting quality single-season teams first
kickthedonkey:: Luke, yes, you'd almost need an ini file with the various options/rules for the draft.
SmokinBats:: one thing I'd like to see sometime with the game is the ability to hit one button on the manager profile and everyone is either activated, or farmed
#timz:: Or the ability to fire the CM
dewelar:: Or just make them all selectable using CTRL-Click.
rcm3739:: No kidding
rcm3739:: Or at least take away the CM's crack pipe.
SmokinBats:: that'd be cool as well dewelar
rcm3739:: I'll second CTRL-Click
DMBDayne:: Look, it had Johnny Mize bunt for me yesterday. I yelled, "TIPPPPPETTTTTTTTTT!!!!"
#timz:: No Christmas bonus for Tom!
DMBDayne:: of course, I never changed his bunt setting from the default...
rcm3739:: I swear the CM has a fetish for certain players.
DMBDayne:: still... some things need... uh, "adjusted"
dewelar:: Consistency of interface (i.e., making the Roster screen look like the Organizer) would probably help.
SmokinBats:: will we see much before the new year though given that in 6 weeks or so the '07 season disk will start dominating the workload for all of you guys?
DMBDayne:: the WTD ('worst teams disk") is next, then 07 season disk
#timz:: Who "wins" an WTD league...the team with the most wins or the most losses?
SmokinBats:: that'll be like in mid Dec like normal for the '07 season disk right?
dmbluke:: that's the plan
rcm3739:: Does anyone here go to the Shandlerfest in Arizona?
dmbluke:: we always try to make them ready for the holidays
DMBDayne:: folks, would love to continue, but I'm already late for a meeting.
rcm3739:: Thanks for the chat Dayne.
dewelar:: Dayne, glad to have you here with good news :) .
dmbluke:: we probably can't say a lot but Jim Wheeler and I are here
rcm3739:: I missed the news, will a transcript be posted?
SmokinBats:: yeah this is awesome news
DMBDayne:: we saved the chat and will post.
nemodomi:: Luke ... found the WTD teams list?
SmokinBats:: what about the seasons from '74-'77 that have all the retrosheet stuff. Will we see them deluxed?
dewelar:: Ah, yes, deluxe seasons...something high on my list!
dewelar:: Nearly forgot about that. :-/
DMBDayne:: I'd like to do this more often, though my schedule and the atmosphere around here has made that difficult. But I'll pop in when I can.
nemodomi:: Kudos to you Dayne for braving the atmosphere!
DMBDayne:: I like these impromptu ones better than the scheduled chats, frankly.
SmokinBats:: thanks for your time Dayne, we really appreciate it a lot
dmbluke:: argh, I'm overloading my multi-tasking abilities plus I'm a poor typist
dewelar:: Dayne: I can understand why.
SmokinBats:: I like these chats that have great news like this myself
dewelar:: They tend to be a little less confrontational.
DMBDayne:: Thanks, folks. later!
SmokinBats:: yeah- people can't load up for bear
dewelar:: I should get going as well.
#DMBJim:: Clear for the worst teams list...
SmokinBats:: yeah lets see how many I got right
buckshotrod:: Guess I missed all the good stuff?
dmbluke:: we're keeping a transcript
dmbluke:: Say, Dayne just left, just a coincidence?
buckshotrod:: Geez I got on and Dayne left..just when I was going to rip into him..
#timz:: you were voted MVP (most valuable poster), buckshotrod, and sposfan1 quit the forum in protest
#DMBJim:: 1899 Cleveland, 1904 Washington, 1916 Philadelphia, 1925 Boston, 1939 St. Louis, 1948 Chicago, 1952 Pittsburgh, 1962 New York, 1979 Oakland, 1988 Baltimore, 1998 Florida, 2003 Detroit
buckshotrod:: Sposfan quit??? Not a chance
CUBS06:: Thank you for the information Dayne.
#timz:: hey, the Yanks were pretty good in '62!
kickthedonkey:: Chicago??? Oh! That's the White Sox
#DMBJim:: any questions for me, otherwise I've got finsh up some cps1928 work.
SmokinBats:: so we had called 6 of the 12 teams
SmokinBats:: mine would be '74-'77
SmokinBats:: what's the status of those seasons?
buckshotrod:: cps1928??? get them 70s done buddy!
nemodomi:: Thanks Jim.
#DMBJim:: 1974 to 1977 will be updated as will the other cps seasons.
dmbluke:: Jim's not currently working on them , I think he needs some more training from Tom for deluxe seasons
buckshotrod:: Nooooo...start with 1970 then go to 1977!!!!
SmokinBats:: going to need to start saving up some money now I think
#DMBJim:: anyone? anyone?
buckshotrod:: Pleassseeeeee Jim
buckshotrod:: My night is ruined!
#DMBJim:: Good night!
SmokinBats:: great news overall though
buckshotrod:: sleep on it Jim
Daniel Evensen:: Looks like I came in too late -- wha'd I miss?
SmokinBats:: can't wait to see the '01-'26 seasons finally
dmbluke:: there are three classes of seasons to work on: 1901-1926, 1927-1956, and 1957-1977
dmbluke:: We'll post a transcript
#timz:: Since there's only three they'll be done this year, right?
buckshotrod:: Get the boat steered in the right direction Luke..u gotta start at 1970 then move forward
dmbluke:: Jim's fully trained to work on 1927-56 so he's working on them now
buckshotrod:: not 1974 to 77 the go backwards
#timz:: '69, bucks...first year of expansion
SmokinBats:: what kind of work is being done '27-'56?
dmbluke:: As he gets trained on the others, Dayne will have to set priorities
buckshotrod:: cool beans on that then just don't start at 74
SmokinBats:: and '57-'77?
buckshotrod:: Me and Dayne is going to have to talk then!
dmbluke:: Those are the years where the Retrosheet data is nearly complete
dmbluke:: Jim will be getting trained for deluxe seasons since he'll be glued to Tom for the 2007 season
#timz:: sounds uncomfortable...and a little icky
dmbluke:: Hopefully no shoe tapping
#timz:: he was just "taking a wide stance"
SmokinBats:: will Jim after '07 then branch to deluxe, or will he be involved in the '08 projection disk?
dmbluke:: Don't know for sure but I suspect so. Right now only Tom knows how to do it and that's going to change
dmbluke:: Are there any other pending questions that I failed to answer?
SmokinBats:: my hunch of things is this- the next year or so going to be spent updating the seasons, then after that going to work on the game itself...
SmokinBats:: is that accurate?
dmbluke:: Argh, phone call
dmbluke:: I wouldn't say so
BiggieCohen:: Hello everyone.
dmbluke:: Jim isn't a programmer so he'll be devoted to that
dmbluke:: I'm mostly a programmer so I'll be spending more time on that
SmokinBats:: so both kind of getting done at the same time then???
dmbluke:: Diesel will be doing more tech support freeing me from a lot of that
RedTurkey:: Will there be more patches before v10
dmbluke:: Yes, but seasons are much more contained so they can come out when ready
dmbluke:: I suspect no more patches unless there's a killer bug we're not aware of
SmokinBats:: gotcha.. great news there
dmbluke:: there's so many things we'd like to do
dmbluke:: the hard part is not aiming too high
dmbluke:: I'd like to go to a new interface but that's not my specialty
SmokinBats:: well some outstanding news here tonight... can't wait to see it all play out.....
SmokinBats:: worst teams disk going to be a lot of fun to play with....
dmbluke:: Pretty painful if you ask me - they're all horrible!
SmokinBats:: see some good guys though in there
SmokinBats:: '79 A's- Rickey Henderson for one
dmbluke:: DMBJim, I don't have the BP book yet but who won/lost?
#timz:: Ricky was only a part-timer that year
dmbluke:: In case anyone is interested, we'll probably be password protecting the off-topics area
nemodomi:: Yeah, what's the effect of that?
dmbluke:: some members were poo-pooing about kids seeing stuff there but we heard from a fair number of concerned parents
nemodomi:: oh, thanks. Makes sense now.
#timz:: how do you control who gets the password, though?
dmbluke:: It'll be an opt-in so you'll have to ask for the PW
SmokinBats:: yeah it does make sense
#timz:: can't kids ask?
#DMBJim:: Looks like 88 Baltimore. It can be hard to read some of there stuff.
SmokinBats:: 88 Baltimore worst team ever?
dmbluke:: yes, kids can ask but it's one more hoop. Maybe Pat will give them an age specific quiz! :-)
dmbluke:: I wonder how many times BP ran the season.
#DMBJim:: 88 Baltimore won the Baseball Prospectus tourney of worst teams.
dmbluke:: something like that we'd run at least 100 times
#DMBJim:: 12 season runs. I got the book at Barnes and Noble
#timz:: If IS forum already has a no-holds-barred Off Topic forum, why does DMB need one...just direct that traffic over there
rldp4444:: Luke - Was the nude pics the major concern?
SmokinBats:: so are they the best of the worst, or the worst of the worst?
#timz:: They'd be the strongest team on that list, I imagine
dmbluke:: that was going to be my question. the Spiders gotta be the worst
DMB87:: If Baltimore won, then who was the worst team
dmbluke:: the pics were the concern of the parents
#timz:: don't blame them, really
dmbluke:: but I don't think that's what broke the camel's back for Dayne
rldp4444:: But not the anti-Semitic screed? I'm "amazed"
#DMBJim:: Flip a coin, I guess. looks like 1979 Oakland is the worst.
#timz:: that surprises me (the '79 Oakland thing)
SmokinBats:: yeah the Spiders pitching in 1899 was just amazing
DMB87:: I came in late, what book are we talking about at B & N?
dmbluke:: I had a talk with Kira today and everyone's agreed that the DMB MB should have different rules
#timz:: as for the politics...this forum was a much pleasanter, more productive place when it was kept out
rldp4444:: Luke - What exactly do you think broke the camel's back with Dayne?
#DMBJim:: Maybe it is the Spiders. You really have to read the entire chapter to see what they were doing. I'm just glancing at it right now.
#timz:: there were a lot of straws, rldp
#timz:: might have just been the whole accumulation
dmbluke:: politics - I think having OT has simmered down the other sections except for the banning ones
rldp4444:: Unless 2DBB was threatening his life, I can't really see what he said that would have caused all this commotion.
dmbluke:: I'd say the accumulation although I wasn't here for the first 10 minutes of the chat. Don't know if Dayne addressed it
rldp4444:: Besides, DMB with still take 2DBB's money, right?
#timz:: what's that got to do with the forum?
dmbluke:: 2DBB has had it out for Dayne since day one and bad-mouthed him every chance he could
SmokinBats:: 2dbb has been nasty to Dayne ever since dmb was sold...... Nothing Dayne could say would appease him at all....
rldp4444:: He could have been told not to post nude pics because of parental concerns.
dmbluke:: seeing all the pointless posts which were there just to annoy us did it
rldp4444:: But he was basing that on the factt that anything goes on the IS forum
dmbluke:: even if there weren't any pics, I think he would have banned him
#timz:: I suspect there were a number of attempts off-line to get 2DBB to cool it a bit
rldp4444:: How do you know that timz
#timz:: because something is (and should be) allowed in some places doesn't mean it should be allowed everywhere...that makes no sense
dmbluke:: I think that he was trying to make a pointless point
rldp4444:: That doesn't answer my question timz. Did management talked to 2DBB about the offending posts?
dmbluke:: in three years there had NEVER been an issue with pics and obscenity
#timz:: I don't *know* it, but a number of comments that were posted only made sense if there were back-channel contacts going on
dmbluke:: Yes, 2DBB was spoken to
rldp4444:: Again Luke. His point was that if everything is allowed on the IS forum, what are the rules for the DMB forum?
dmbluke:: By posting all that crap plus the other nonsense with the books
#timz:: would you prefer an iron-clad legal list of things that are allowed?
dmbluke:: But why post it?
#timz:: I don't think that's necessary or desireable
dmbluke:: he posted it to annoy us
rldp4444:: All tyou can say is no naked pics, racicst material allowed. Simple.
#timz:: Once you start taking a legalistic stance, nothing is that simple
dmbluke:: you post pictures of puppies and Michael Vick might complain
rldp4444:: Yes he was trying to annoy you. But was he explicitly told not to continue posting nude pics and if so, then I would agree to his banning.
dmbluke:: with that being said, we will be TRYING to come up with a formal policy
dmbluke:: I have no idea how that'll go
dmbluke:: it was Dayne's call. He got up early Sunday morning and had his fill
SmokinBats:: if someone keeps pushing the line like 2dbb did, you're going to eventually get to a point where something puts you over the edge.....
rldp4444:: Did 2DBB ttempt to apologize to Dayne?
dmbluke:: and frankly, 2DBB was costing us a lot of time and money
#timz:: well, I certainly post my share and maybe a few more of "contentless" post (though I'm not leading the league) so I can't say "DMB or nothing", but I do try to censor myself a little bit
rldp4444:: How does 2DBB cost you time and money? I don't follow?
dmbluke:: Me. I've had to monitor this forum CLOSELY for the last couple weeks
SmokinBats:: all of us have contentless posts, but 2dbb took things way to personal with Dayne I thought.....
dmbluke:: That means I'm not doing productive work
#timz:: Yes, I think it's VERY important to not take after people personally
#timz:: Even CEOs
dmbluke:: you know, I bet if 2DBB hadn't been so vicious with Dayne for the past year, he'd still be on the forum
dmbluke:: they could have worked it out
rldp4444:: timz, we all do it on this board.
rldp4444:: Luke - How could the have worked it out if Dayne refuse to talk to him?
#timz:: We disagree, but by and large people do not insult each other personally
dmbluke:: 2DBB wanted to patch it up after the banning but that was a bit too late for that
nemodomi:: funny he never mentioned that part on his site ;-)
#timz:: I hope he'll be back eventually...but just the "good" 2DBB
dmbluke:: well after someone's been calling you evil for a year and how you're destroying DMB, I wouldn't want to talk with him either
rldp4444:: Well, I'm trying. I just don't like the idea of banning somebody who is a customer.
#timz:: he's made many positive contributions along with the not-so-positive stuff
dmbluke:: I don't disagree that he contributed but the price got to be too high
rldp4444:: Calling Dayne 'evil" was just an embellishment. I'm sure it was not that nefarious.
dmbluke:: Have you noticed some of the classy posters aren't around any more
rldp4444:: For example, who?
#timz:: Hey...I'm still here....ohhhhhhhh
dmbluke:: well, that's the problem with text only messaging, things don't always translate well
SmokinBats:: thing that got me was how we'd have a good discussion going and he'd put in a bizarre picture and just blow up the entire thread..... he did that way too much.....
rldp4444:: That's one. Has anybody tried to contact him?
psieczko:: I totally agree with Luke. It was evident to me much of what 2DBB wrote was designed to antagonize. Imagine if you worked for DMB and felt that you had to check the forum periodically throughout the weekend to see if the same guy wasn't starting another shitstorm flame war
dmbluke:: Replayman wrote to me today thanking us for banning 2DBB, that that's who drove him away
dmbluke:: Pat is FURIOUS with 2DBB for ruining so many evenings and weekends
rldp4444:: You're kidding, right? Did Replayman have a run-in with 2DBB?
dmbluke:: no, he just got tired of seeing all the crap over and over and over again
psieczko:: 2DBB and the guy who started the "DMB Patch Fact or Fiction" thread while the patch was in beta are big reasons why I havent even bothered to post much in the last year
rldp4444:: Are you being facetious with the Pat comment?
#timz:: You have to work some to piss off Pat
#timz:: She seems very nice
dmbluke:: and she's got a worse temper than me
rldp4444:: Is 2DBB the only problem poster who's being scrutinized?
dmbluke:: we both have LONG fuses but her evenings and weekends are very dear to her
rldp4444:: Besides me of course...
psieczko:: this is a hobby. I don't know why he always had to interject drama non-stop. who wants drama from their hobby
rldp4444:: What about Toldya and his political rants?
dmbluke:: well politics are OK under IS but we'll see while we're working on the DMB forum policy
dmbluke:: I sent some of his more objectionable posts to the IS side and they pretty much laughed compared to their board
#timz:: I'd ban it from DMB...it just creates hard feelings and has nothing to do with the forum
#timz:: Until recently it was almost entirely absent from the board, but allowing it even in the Off Topic are seemed to poison the entire board
dmbluke:: we see the Off Topic area as a way to blow off steam and keep the rest of the forum clear
#timz:: that would be "area"
rldp4444:: Sorry Luke. I didn't follow your last post. Did you mean "they pretty much laugh compared to THIS board"?
dmbluke:: yeah, they laughed at how tame his posts were compared to some posts on their side
#timz:: there should be (and there are) places for that kind of exchange...it just shouldn't be here
rldp4444:: Toldya is my new "friend". He likes to send me ezinbox messages.
#timz:: we can't all be that lucky
rldp4444:: I told him I was Canadian, but he still lectures me on voting for Bush.
dmbluke:: Maybe he knows something the rest of us don't!
dmbluke:: Are the troops massing on the border?
#timz:: And Luke...no foreigners!
dmbluke:: sposfan, put down the child and join in!
#timz:: No post count here!
rldp4444:: Well according to him, Canada like 9-11 never happened.
SmokinBats:: he's always quiet during chats when posts don't count
SmokinBats:: I just can't believe it's been 10 years now since Princess Diana died.....
rldp4444:: And she's still dead.
dmbluke:: boy that sure changed the subjects!
the boken:: hope it isn't my arrival that did thatLOL
dmbluke:: it's been going on for 2 hours and I think the party is breaking up
rldp4444:: You're right. Goodnight.
dmbluke:: and cook has the evening off
SmokinBats:: it's been a great chat though
dmbluke:: I can't wait to see the transcript from the start - i came in late
SmokinBats:: yeah same here
#timz:: thanks for everything, Luke...appreciate your work and the rest of the folks at DMB
dmbluke:: appearantly there was some nastiness
dmbluke:: I really am a nice guy even though I was getting pretty steamed lately
#timz:: more aggressive questions than nastiness, I think
dmbluke:: Dayne was supposed to copy the transcript - hope he did it right
dmbluke:: were you here from the beginning of the chat?
SmokinBats:: wow Phillies beat the Mets again tonight...... 3 games out now....
dmbluke:: or anyone?
#timz:: I think I was the third person in
#timz:: so I didn't miss much
dmbluke:: have you been on the whole time?
#timz:: it has been a while no, hasn't it
dmbluke:: you gotta love those races
dmbluke:: even without the wild card
#timz:: that laundry that was supposed to get done tonight will just have to wait, I guess
SmokinBats:: and what a great early week schedule this week
SmokinBats:: 5 series with 1 vs 2 in the division......
dmbluke:: OK Tim, here's what you need to do. don't start until I'm done. Oh, do you have Word?
#timz:: CBS is announcing a special report on Princess Di for tomorrow night...you guys are in luck
#timz:: or should that be "Word up"
dmbluke:: OK - you'll click on the "use text mode" button...
#timz:: I've had that on from the start
dmbluke:: right-click on the message area and and choose Select All
dmbluke:: right-click again and choose Copy
dmbluke:: start up a new Word doc and paste into it
dmbluke:: you can email it to me at email@example.com
SmokinBats:: well if the Brewers lose tonight they're done... up right now 6-1 in the 7th inning....
dmbluke:: who are they playing?
dmbluke:: my 77 year old mom will be up past her bedtime!
SmokinBats:: Sheets came back off the DL tonight
SmokinBats:: pitched 6 innings. He's out of the game now- and Shouse has allowed 1st 2 guys to reach base.....
dmbluke:: if he's pitching tonight, you gotta like only giving up one
#timz:: here's a question...I'm on a Mac and my mouse doesn't seem to have a right-click button...or it doesn't bring up a pop-up menu...any suggestions
nemodomi:: use control click
nemodomi:: hold control (not command) key down while clicking
#timz:: gives me the copy pop-up box...I'll just try to scroll back and select everything the hard way
#timz: doesn't go nearly all the way back, Luke...sorry...just until buckshotrod's arrival, which was pretty late
nemodomi: i just tested ... click in the text ... hit command-A to select all ...
nemodomi: then you could just hit command-c to copy
#timz: is command the key with the apple on it?
dmbluke: Yankees beating BoSox in the 8th 4-3
dmbluke: ARod with #44
SmokinBats: he'll be up to Bonds before we know it if he stays healthy
dmbluke: Firing Garner worked, Astros willing 4-0
nemodomi: ... timz learning how to use his new Mac ... ;-) :-)
SmokinBats: if they win they'd be only 9 out of 1st place.....
dmbluke: they're beating the Cards which is what really matters
dmbluke: argh, Angels beat the M's again
SmokinBats: Indians threatening to run away with the AL Central again
#timz: ouch...Office test drive software has expired and buying costs $399...probably not...sorry, Luke--forgot I was on the Mac and not one of the PCs
dmbluke: I wish employees could bet, this year's projections have been incredible
#timz: any alternatives?
#timz: Right, Pete...I mean Luke...no betting
dmbluke: yes, it doesn't have to be Word
nemodomi: timz just use the text program ... TextEdit, that will be fine
dmbluke: plain text would be perfect
dmbluke: any more DMB questions?
SmokinBats: oh great, we now get 2 lukes!
#timz: still only went back as far as buckshotrod's entrance...sorry
dmbluke: don't worry about it then. I have most and if Dayne captured the early stuff then we're set
nemodomi: when you hit command-A did everything turn blue?
#timz: do you have at least that much yourself?
#timz: all blue
#timz: It wouldn't scroll any further back than that, either...don't know where the first hour-plus went
SmokinBats: '07 season disk will be really awesome I think
nemodomi: Hmm ... dunno how you seem to have lost stuff, unless you signed off then on ... I was about third here ... within five minutes of the start ... Luke, do you want that? IF so I need the email addy again.
#timz: you were next after me, i think
#timz: you didn't miss anything
#timz: connection never flaked out